>this is >not desnensitization, as i understand it--is there anything here that we >haven't seen before? i don't think so--but elaboration and extrapolation. De-sensitizing someone to violence isn't showing them something new and horribly graphic - it's showing the same sort of violence over and over again so often that the they begin to accept it as normal. I don't mean to say that NBK is going to de-sensitize people any more than they already are - just that it's not free from the "de-sensitization syndrome" just because it isn't showing anything new. That said, I have finally seen NBK and I liked it. It just doesn't stop. I liked the chaos of mixed footage, styles, and everything else. I would have to agree that at times the panoply gets tiresome, but overall I liked it a lot. As an aside, my eyes hurt afterwards, but I think that's because of an eye infection, not the movie. It's so hard to tell these days. ;) I haven't seen too many Oliver Stone movies. I saw most of JFK, and I think I saw Platoon when I was young, but other than that I don't have a clear "this is waht Oliver Stone does" image. Seeing NBK, I didn't find any terribly overt or crazy half-baked mysticism, nor did I find a preachy this-is-our-dying-culture theme. I saw a vast array of images that are left mostly for the audience to sort out. I don't think Stone has a mouthpiece in this film. Even when Mickey is being interviewed, it isn't Stone talking (I hope); he sounds like most of the real-life criminals and killers that have been interviewed to date. He has a logic to his actions, a twisted logic by most standards. It reminded me of Renoir's assertion that the most frightening thing in the world is that everyone has a reason. At any rate, I didn't find too much of what others on this list complained about. My only concern, which was brought out by a friend who saw it, isimilar to what others have voiced, which is that while the film may be a technical marvel of craftsmanship, the audience is not always going to be academic auteurs. NBK is not an answer to our social ills - but that won't stop some people for getting motivated and trying to use it as a catalyst for change. _________________________ Sometimes you just have to look Fate square in the eye and say: "You're Right!" [log in to unmask] [log in to unmask]